With the world hurtling towards an authoritarian nightmare because of COVID-19 and the political response thereof, I invited back to the podcast The Uberboyo to discuss the tension between the needs of the collective and that of the individual and how that fits into Nietzsche’s concept of the Ubermensch.
It is an important talk to help define what freedom means and how to frame the discussion, certainly from the libertarians point of view. Because there’s a lot of misconception about what individualists want and what they can help produce in the context of bowing to the needs of the community itself.
And amidst all of this creepy technology how Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies offer the strongest platform from which to build the next system of the world.
Show Notes:
Episode #57 – Uberboyo and How Creativity is the Source of Value
Uberboyo on YouTube
Previous Episodes:
Podcast Episode #79 – Bitcoin and the Futility of the European Union
Podcast Episode #78 – Dexter K. White and Blackrock’s Gambit for a BLM Suburban Takeover
Podcast Episode #77 — Davos, The Fed and the 5 Basis Points That Moved the World Part III.
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Hi Tom,
You might find this lecture interesting:
Jonathan Haidt: Lecture on morality at Stanford
https://youtu.be/1u-ahvx3pkc
What Haidt posits is that you need something irrational (sacred object/ religion) to trigger ultra-sociality, which in turn brings people together to create civilization. During the civilization “building phase” the pragmatic gains (benefits) outweigh the irrationality aspect of the belief system.
However, once the civilization is created, then there is a process of rationally examining that “sacred object/belief system”, because people have the time and leisure to attend to contradictions and the cognitive dissonance, etc. And during this period, people take the civilization for granted, assuming it is the “default normal” when in reality the inhospitable wilderness (what the civilization grew out of) is actually the default normal. (Once the lights go off and the supply chains no longer work, you get a glimpse of the default normal).
And the paradoxical/profound thing about this is that we like to think (if you are scientifically minded) of evolution and progress as a rational thing (natural selection/survival of the fittest, etc) but Haidt is positing in that “irrationality” (the trigger for ultra-sociality) is also a fundamental/ indispensable part of the evolutionary process (one that we have to be tricked or deceived into). And that is somewhat mind boggling. IMHO
An example of this. in microcosm, would be here:
The Jesus of Siberia
https://youtu.be/6Z5FPpoVhX8
Obviously the guy and the community are nuts, but look what they built in the frigid wasteland of the Siberian taiga. That is something an individual could not do. And no doubt, once the challenge of building the community is over, they will need to attend to their belief system.
The other thing about power (and I don’t know what this means) is that people don’t tend to notice it as long as the people and the leadership are striving in the same direction. However, it becomes very recognizable (sometimes as a tyranny) when they are divergent. And from the above example, that might occur in “examination phase” when the people begin questioning their leadership and the leadership senses it is losing the people and then responds with repression.
Anyway, great podcast !!!
Great comment. I’m a fan of Haidt and again I didn’t disagree with Uberboyo about the struggle against chaos and the natural state of conflict being the birthplace of civilization. I recognize that wholly. Where we have to keep in mind during the transition is how we can minimize the damage done to people so civilization can be built as quickly as possible and not languish in tribal violence for generations
That was the other topic I had thought about commenting on, but didn’t want to make the comment too long. I think you have thought more about this than I, but the discussion about our present period reminded me of the initial years of the Russian Revolution. (Stephen Kotkin does a great job describing this in his first volume on Stalin) In that case Tsarist autocracy collapsed and there were essentially two revolutions: the Bolshevik technocrats in the cities and the peasants (practicing spontaneous organic capitalism) in the countryside. Stalin ultimately forced technocratic control through collectivization, but it revealed a great many fissures in the ideology, practicality and personalities of the nomenklatura. For some reason I keep looking back at that period for guidance about our present situation. Despite being disorganized and dying in the millions, the peasants eventually prevailed (and their “individual” efforts on family plots save the USSR time and time again ) which reminded me of your comment: “they can arrest one of us, but not a thousand of us”. From the example of the peasants, I conclude that “they” will eventually fail, but how that failure will manifest I can’t yet discern. I didn’t think of Bitcoin being a disruptive agent, until I began listening to you… so thanks for the insight.
Anyway, thanks again for the thoughtful podcast..
You are welcome. And I greatly appreciate these insights. Well said
If you consider the potential man by his biological needs and the potential for his brain for processing and empathy then evolutionary appropriate foods may be more likely in some ways to help him attain those things. Meanwhile higher-order mammals like humans had tribal lives which reflect distributed development, which coincides with studies a few years back showed humans can barely handle more than 150 people in their social circles. Civilization crushed this natural behavior and replaced it with carbohydrates which helped our brains and hearts dramatically while also moving away from ketones from hunter-gatherers, which causes a shift in your emotions and disposition if you ever try it. Nonetheless as he points out, the hunter-gatherers were much more impressive specimens.
However unless I missed it there’s no mention of their empathy within tribes, the same way man painted the wolf. I disagreed with objectivists in the past and later realized this was because of the ignorance of the science behind man’s biological needs and the physiological workings of his brain, relying instead of faulty pure psychology (psychologists rank poorly in my world, while psychiatry is completely corrupt). In other words potential is tied to biological needs from which you can make an argument where libertarian socialism (not state socialism obviously, and I like to contrast philosophically with anarcho-communism though they say it’s the same) is closest to those evolutionary derived needs, and much behavior is tied to the physiological health of his brain and heart, making other claims more superfluous.
In other words I disagree a little with your guest as to the nature of corruption of man and the level of damage inflicted by civilization on our psyches. We end up with an abundance of dogma and mental disease and eventually self-destruct at the lower echelons like ghettos. In fact like you argue, corruption is a permanent feature of civilization, and any social structures and institutions are broken that don’t proactively recognize it from their inception, like a computer without a firewall. It’s never been about utopia but the road there and recognizing each change to an institution should drive a relative increase in freedom at that time rather than overnight utopian revolution.
So the main benefit to humans I see from civilization is simply agriculture which increased carbohydrate consumption, but even those could be found in nature wherever humans learned to dig up tubers and climb trees for honey. What it mainly provides today is industry. It’s telling we all see civilized man as pitiful since this is completely unnecessary and contrived. Meanwhile hunter-gatherer man mostly needed carbs and soap. You drive brain development, the rest is inevitable. If you quantify brain potential using empathy – since disease opposes it, as documented in many research articles on parasitism and its effect on neurobiology – you find it amply in tribal cultures, more than many civilizations, and nowhere was this more evident than in North America where they also took care of their food supply and smoked good stuff.
I didn’t disagree much on anything Tom said although collectivism could be qualified even more in public discussions as necessarily voluntary and dangerous at state level since nothing stays the same. Otherwise this is obviously all only my opinion.
These days you look at groups like antifa and they appear more like controlled opposition to herd the anti-colonialist sentiment and to blame whites instead of the british (what american exceptionalism helps hide), but essentially I agree with them on underlying sentiments. They identify as anarchists sometimes more than marxists and it loosely relates to sentiments experienced by native tribes, so I wonder how to get those kids back from orange man bad college mind control to actually care about fixing ghettos instead of creating them and then maybe we can talk about civilization because it looks already gone since everyone talks but no one communicates.
We need a larger map :-): https://youtu.be/osNmf_zmSyE?t=436 (The Prisoner – Arrival)
Another commenter on the previous post already called this one…. The lockdown and the healthcare passports are already going the way of the 1930s prohibition.
It’s obvious Fauci doesn’t know what he is talking about. He is corrupt, and funded the gain of function research, but it’s also obvious that underneath it all he just doesn’t get it. He is the stooge puppet that Davos put on tv so they can hide in the shadows.
Covid has a 99.7% survival rate. People died WITH covid, not from it. They had other health issues that killed them, or weakened them to the point that whatever common flu or infection came along next would kill them. Covid maybe got there before the flu, or maybe the hospital wanted higher reimbursement rates. But covid wasn’t the true problem.
for 99.7% of us, covid is not an issue. We can get it and recover from it and we would have no idea if we had a bad flu or covid unless a lab tech told us.
There are alcoholics in our society. We all know this. But instituting Prohibition didn’t solve alcoholism. Most people can have a few drinks and we are ok. Locking down all alcohol was a stupid grasp for political power, and the majority of the population just worked around it.
Several big companies have agreed, at least officially, to ban employees who haven’t genuflected to Washington with a health passport. We will see if they actually stick to that promise as it costs them more and more.
Small businesses and individuals are already ignoring the new prohibition. If you want to attract the best employees, you can’t treat them like babies. It is that simple. Smart people know covid isn’t really an issue if you get it, and like the flu you almost certainly will get it and survive just fine.
Biden will be dead soon. He has bad dementia and very few people believe he will live out his term. Harris couldn’t get elected in the democratic primary, and her failure at the southern border shows her lack of leadership. They are both finished.
So like the other prohibition, this dumb idea will wear itself out. The people who push for lockdowns and excluding their fellow citizens may appear powerful now, but their treachery will be remembered long after the dust settles.
One other thought, sorry I don’t want to dominate your comments, but if you are looking for other disruptors, like Bitcoin, I think you have to consider the internet/social media. Originally, when it came out, our technocrats marketed it by saying it would “bring everyone together” into a “global community”, but in reality, it has done the opposite. Additionally, it has disrupted “their” mechanism of narrative creation, to the point where they are having to get the genie back in the bottle by banning and censoring people.
A few years ago, I was looking at Marshall McLuhan’s “the medium is the message” and noticed that there was a correlation between printing presses and revolutions. So, for example if you look at the American Revolution, the areas with the most revolutionary zeal were those areas with the most presses. And within about 70 years of the introduction of the printing press, the Protestant Reformation occurred. It is a pretty half-baked observation and I would have to do a lot more work to verify the correlation, to make an academic paper out of it, but I believe/sense there is something there.
Now, with the advent of the internet and social media, everyone has their own printing press (which is very interesting).
So, given that, if you look at the primary difference between the Roman and other pagan religions, one of the most significant differences is the REQUIREMENT of the “weekly mass”. And if you go back to McLuhan, you could classify the mass as a communication medium. And to give you an idea of how pervasive the weekly mass is: travel anywhere in South America, even to the remotest regions, and you will invariably find a Catholic Church (before there is even a store in the town).
Example:
https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/old-wooden-church-bulnes-fort-old-historic-church-bulnes-fort-near-punta-arenas-patagonia-chile-118741818.jpg
I also believe is one of the things that has made Judaism so resilient over the millennia. So, you could consider Christianity as an open/inclusive form a Judaism.
This is a bit an antiseptic/uninspiring way of looking at things, but McLuhan asserted that the medium was more important than the content. So, who knows?
Anyway, sorry to clutter up your comments, but I thought your podcasts (#75,#76,#77) were super super insightful and I wanted to return the favor.
As I listened to your “And here we go” podcast, I figured you may find this quote amusing:
From Richard Morgan’s “Altered Carbon”: “The personal, as everyone’s so fucking fond of saying, is political. So if some idiot politician, some power player, tries to execute policies that harm you or those you care about, TAKE IT PERSONALLY. Get angry. The Machinery of Justice will not serve you here – it is slow and cold and it is theirs, hardware and soft. Only the little people suffer at the hands of Justice, the creatures of power slide out from under with a wink and a grin. If you want Justice, you will have to claw it from them. Make it PERSONAL. Do as much damage as you can. GET YOUR MESSAGE ACROSS. That way you stand a far better chance of being taken seriously next time. Of being considered dangerous. And make no mistake about this, being taken seriously, being considered dangerous, marks the difference, the ONLY difference in their eyes between players and little people. Players they will make deals with. Little people they will liquidate. And time and again they cream your liquidation, your displacement, your torture and brutal execution with the ultimate insult that it’s just business, it’s just politics, it’s the way of the world, it’s a tough life and IT’S NOTHING PERSONAL. Well, Fuck them. Make it personal.
Politics is personal. Agreed.
Anyone keeping a tally of how many Obama party goers have dropped dead from covid? They didn’t check health Passports and more to the point they weren’t wearing masks like dictator Fauci ordered. There was no social distancing. They ate food and drank together. At least Some of them shared marijuana.
It’s been a week. A large number should be dead or at least in the hospital dying. By the end of next week, a real pandemic would lay waste to the attendees.
If a lot of them aren’t dead by next week, then we know masks are just for show and totally unnecessary. All the SP500 companies that have been alienating customers and employees with silly mandates will have a lot of explaining to do.
Obama’s arrogance has completely destroyed davos plans for further shutdown.
Of course the losers in DC don’t have the stones to hold Fauci accountable for this horrid crime. But the show is over, and no amount of censorship can hide the number of Obama partners/Hollywood types that should be dead… if a lockdown was warranted
There were 48 covid positive tests on Martha’s Vineyard the week before Obama’s party, 25 of those cases were persons who had been fully “vaccinated” (if it doesn’t give immunity or prevent transmission, is it really a vaccine?).
The week after Obama’s party, they had 74 cases. But mainland Massachusetts also had a similar percentage increase in cases (actually a slight but more percentage wise). Again, more than half of cases were in persons who had two mRNA shots.
Media reports don’t say how many of those positive test cases were asymptomatic, how many were just like getting a cold, and how many required hospitalization. Throughout Fauci’s power grab, hospitalizations have been a tiny fraction of what “experts” warned. Most cases are asymptotic or the person thinks they have a bad cold. Unlike a real pandemic, survival rates are close to 100%. It’s not a big deal unless the patient has lots of other complications.
That’s why Obama didn’t cancel. When he was president, Obama had access to French intelligence warning of the gain of function research at wuhan. He ordered Fauci to halt funding. As a former president, Obama continues to get security briefings. He knows the true risks, as opposed to the media hype.
The lockdowns were stupid, unnecessary and counter productive… from day one. It was always greedy Fauci on a power grab.
Tens of thousands of small businesses destroyed.
Hundreds of thousands of other medical conditions ignored / untested.
Hundreds of thousands of mental health issues caused by the unnecessary lockdown.
That is Anthony Fauci’s legacy. How is this imbecile still employed? Government isn’t known as a meritocracy, but holy crap is Fauci a screw up.
I think comments don’t make it through your spam filter when using Tor (Browser) whenever the comment is too long, it triggers noscript
That may be it. Thanks for the info
Uberboyo’s comments strike me as a whole lot of mental masturbation.
How is he defining civilised? People are civilised because they have roads? Hunter gathers are barbarians because they chase deer?
You civilise someone by beating them into submission?
Christianity is civilised?
A crucifix is a torture device.
Christians worship at and wear a symbol of the torture device that was used to torture Christ.
Catholics have a ritual of eating the body of Christ and drinking the blood of Christ.
Does this not sound like a cannibalistic ritual.
What sort of entity would be behind this type of behaviour?
“Satan” is often referred to as the Great Deceiver. Would it not be one of the greatest deceptions to convince people to worship the very thing that they claim to oppose?
This is civilised?
There is Individual Power and there is political power. Political power is power over others. This is the power to beat the dog to make it do what you want it to do.
Continuing to listen to him is just annoying. (I’m writing this as I’m listening)
Nietzsche, Nietzsche, Nietzsche. Is that all he has, can he not come up with his own perspectives, or is he all about regurgitating others.
Don’t see what the value was with much of what he said. Most of it was regurgitated from other people.